Looky here!
http://kansascity.craigslist.org/rvs/809538523.html

I replied to this ad, hoping to get a build # for our records. This is as close as I've seen to my coach, but we've seen it before. The lateral trim splines in the grills are out of wack. If I was to start collecting Euros I'd buy this one, but I'll let somebody else get it, and maybe I'll be able to get them through new owner pains.

Come on, Danny! We know you want twins.

My brother and I actually bought this coach over the past weekend. Even tho the link is out-dated I believe it's the same coach, Kansas City location, outta whack grill.
We're ok with it so far, got a good price (at least we think so.. so don't pop our bubble..lol) and nothing we didnt expect buying near 30 yrs old. Just can't get the miss out of the motor yet, but give us a couple days.
We found this site after we had looked at the RV and wanted more information. Great site with tons of info.. thanks to all responsible.

Now, if it'd stop raining we can keep chasing the darn miss. Does it under load, suspect it is the Quadrajet. It was supposedly rebuilt but running out of culprits. (Filters, drained tanks, vacuum hoses, fuel pump, trans module, timed. Not near as bad, but still wants to skip under load especially when shifting)

I'd suggest replacing the spark plug wires - and for the 454, the GM set is said to be best, although I had very good results with the NAPA Premium.

quote:

Originally posted by DaveBnKC:
Just can't get the miss out of the motor yet, but give us a couple days.


Now, if it'd stop raining we can keep chasing the darn miss. Does it under load, suspect it is the Quadrajet. It was supposedly rebuilt but running out of culprits. (Filters, drained tanks, vacuum hoses, fuel pump, trans module, timed. Not near as bad, but still wants to skip under load especially when shifting)

Hi Dave, and Welcome.

You could be right on the Quadrajet. Is the power piston free to move up and down? How is the float level? Sometimes a Qjet will start behaving after sitting overnight with a float bowl full of carb cleaner. I have used Berryman, Gumout and Sea Foam, all with good result. Plus, it kills all the skeeters in the block when you fire it up.

Continuing with fuel.......Bad fuel or water in it can also make an engine stumble. I had a load of crud in a tank once, that gave me fits. Since the contents of your tank are of unknown age or origin, you could cobble up a suction line from the fuel pump to a gas can of good gas just to see if that cures the miss. My Barth has a drain on the gas tank.

A miss or stumble could also be caused by ignition. One likely suspect area is the ignition wires at the right rear two cylinders. They get a lot of heat damage, both under way and heat soak at rest after shutdown. If you don't know their age, replacing all of them now would be good. The fact that the engine was rebuilt could point to miswired ignition leads. There is a way to miswire a 454 that has driven more than one good mech crazy for a while.

Have you lifted the distributor cap? It and the rotor should be clean and free of carbon tracks. Is their any Dust of the Red Death in there? If so, clean it up and lightly lube the advance mechanism, making sure it is free and not too worn. How is the vacuum advance?

Look at the wires that move with the vacuum advance. Make sure they are not damaged or worn, and that the module connectors are tight and clean. A weak coil can also give you some stumbling or hesitation. It is often accompanied by afterfire in the exhaust, as the unburned fuel charge is ignited by the next successful spark.

Troubleshooting or testing a weak coil can be difficult, particularly if they only act up when warm. If you put in a new one and still have the miss, you now know two things:

1. The problem is not the coil.

2. You now have a good spare.

Many rotors have a resistor in them that acts up when hot. Again, hard to test, easy to substitute.

How are the plugs? Did you do a compression check? A sticking valve might not show up on a compression test, but can cause a sporadic miss. A squirt of Berryman B12 on each valve stem is fun if your engine doesn't have umbrellas.

Hi, and thanks for the time and suggestions.
I forgot to mention that we did put a new set of wires on first thing, and the plugs look really good and were properly gapped, altho to me they looked dry-ish lean, but the motor smells fat .. so I'm not sure. I have had the cap off, it looks new and there isn't obvious evidence of arching but I have considered a weak coil causing a flood out under load. I also checked for firing order and I think that part is correct. While there I also checked for play in the distributor shaft and it seems very tight.

One thing I think might have been misunderstood, the motor wasn't rebuilt, it has about 75K on it, the carb was supposedly rebuilt.

As for other fuel issues... we do have two tanks, and the gas was stale. There is a drain plug on the passenger tank, we drained it and besides being stalish, it was mostly sediment free. We put about 5-6 gallons of fuel in and double dosed it with Sea Foam. One interesting thing to ponder, it has an added marine grade fuel filter added by the previous owner, supposedly has some water seperating abilty as well and might be worth a consideration as the culprit since its not original equipment. The owner before us was a marine mechanic, it's a twist on under the front bumper, and tells me that he's been fighting this battle as well no doubt.

I really think that the Q-jet was built or 'tuned' incorrectly or is full of bad gas and stuck or clogged. I'm not a mechanic by trade but I do have some experience under the hood. Unfortunately .. including automatic transmissions.. Carbs are something I usually pawned off or paid someone to do for me.

Of all the attempts we've made, changing an incorrectly fitting PCV valve and the vacuum solenoid on the tranny have had the greatest effect. It's somewhat driveable now but still not up to full use capability. (ie, it made it to its storage place and I'm out of the doghouse at home)

Again, thanks for the ideas. I really enjoy this site so far. I have no doubt that its going to come in handy in the next few months as we start our new "hobby". Hopefully make a few friends along the way.

We did give her a quick bath today (she needs a thorough one soon) and I took some pictures, I just can't seem to get them off my phone, but when I do I will introduce her.

Dave Burton
Shawnee, Kansas

Dave, this is just for you because the guys around here have heard all this from me before. In the 6 years I've had my Euro, I've always had a problem that I believe is vapor lock. It only happens when it's very warm out [85+], and we've travelled quite a long way [50 miles+]. If I let it idle, such as at a light or going down a grade, then accelerate, she'll take off fine for about 7 seconds, then cut out and stumble for a few seconds, then kick in and run fine until the next time I take my foot off the accelerator.
I wrapped the fuel line with heat tape where it runs very close to the dual exhaust on the passenger side frame rail, and that cleared it up pretty well until the heat tape eventually fell off. My next step will be installing some kind of heat shield between the line and the pipe, such as galvanized flashing or something like that.
This isn't a huge problem, as we've made 5 trips to Talledega and many in state trips all over Florida, and it doesn't die, just sputters a little before catching again. I don't know if this is anything like what you are experiencing, as "missing" can mean anything when it comes to an engine, but here it is for what it's worth, and welcome, always good to have another Euro owner in the gang.

With unleaded fuel, plugs will look "too clean" to those of us brought up in the leaded gaso era.

The Quadra-Jet was actually a pretty dependable carb.,,I say that having worked on my share of Solex, SU, Zenith, and others).

Now I would suspect the fuel pump (or if you're lucky, the fuel filter on the carb). GM has designed it to fail after 50K miles. I did try pushing the one on my SOB I had before my Barth to 57K, and ended up replacing it in an Advance Auto Parts parking lot in 106°F temps. I had the spare pump, but needed a few parts from Advance.

BTW, when you get a chance, please post the datat tag info here or PM Nick Cagle.

BTW2: I visit my sister in Lathrop during the Christmas holidays, and sometimes in July...

Dan,

It's been many years since I had a 454, but they were bad about blowing the carb gasket, that lets the preheat exhaust overheat the carb with your exact symtoms.

Good Luck
Steve

Dave, do you know the fuel filter Rusty is talking about? It's on the front of the carb, where the fuel line comes up from the fuel pump. It's a small, maybe 1/2" dia X 2" long thing. I had the same symptoms you had, and remembered Webbers that had such a filter actually in the carb. Replaced mine and problem gone

Yea.. darnit I do know where that filter is located. I checked it once, it looked clean to me. We took it out and took it for a test run.. ran like a champ. It pulled out of the hole and all the way up to 65. Ran great thru all speed ranges and load. Darnit. Never trust old eyes. lol
In the mean time, I adjusted the carb about 5 times, drained the tanks, blew all the lines and threw about 200 bucks in new parts on it, but in the end I'm happy with them being on there and the maintenance we completed.
Now we can finally enjoy the fact that we bought a motorhome and start bouncing ideas with it a bit instead of monkeying the darn motor.
I meant to photo the TAG in it but was so happy it ran that I forgot and dropped it in storage til Sunday. I'll try to do it then so ya'll know which Barth we have! Thanks for all the help for now...

Dave,I love your use of the phrase 'Darnit'. Bill Cosby does a skit recalling how he and his brother thought for the longest time that their names were 'Dammit and Jesuschrist'!! I would not have been nearly as disciplined as you.
Jim

quote:

Originally posted by DaveBnKC:
My brother and I actually bought this coach over the past weekend.

send me a couple of photos or so, with the data tag, and I'll put a fancy image under your name.

That'll make you feel right at home here!