I had a member contact me a few weeks ago complaining that their vacation was ruined because their propane tank needed to be recertified and they couldn't get this done before they left on their Memorial Day Vacation.

I told them that as far as I knew, the tanks on an RV didn't need to follow the same regs as a BBQ propane tank.

Their answer was "They (propane people) should know, they fill the tanks" - Ok, fair enough. You're right, they should know.

Here is my research on this. Hopefully it'll help someone else who has a hard time getting their tanks filled.

There are 2 types of propane storage vessels, an ASME TANK and the DOT CYLINDER. NFPA pamphlet 58 states that the DOT CYLINDER needs to be recertified after 12 years from the manufacturing date. Depending on the certifying method used, they are recertified every 5,7,12 years thereafter. The recertification involves an inspection and testing of the cylinder to confirm that the cylinder is still safe and legal to remain in service.

ASME TANKS that are found on an RV do not get recertified. They should have the relief valve replaced every 10 years and should follow the same standards established by the Department of Transportation.

Notice the wording here - they go to great lengths to call the BBQ tanks a CYLINDER and the ASME cylinders a TANK.

So... is it time to re-certify that propane tank/cylinder on your RV??? The answer is MAYBE if you have a travel trailer and definitely NO if you have a motorhome. It couldn't hurt, but it is not a requirement on an rv with an ASME TANK, I would have the relief valve replaced after 10 years and the flexible hose connection replaced after 15 years. We've had a few members report that these hoses failed on their coach in the past but these were on 20+ year old coaches.

Now, to the member who had their vacation ruined and suggested that I warn everyone about this dangerous problem on these old Barth Motorhomes. Here it is... your vacation was ruined by an improperly trained propane filler and your inability to get past the notion that maybe the people who should know don't. Contact the company who refused to fill you tank - leave me out of it.

I love to help people fix or get past a problem - but when it crosses the line to exasperation, frustration and telling me that I must do certain things to protect them from all known and unknown dangers. Well, you can imagine the look on my face after I hung up the phone.

NEXT!

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love to help people fix or get past a problem

We hear you loud and clear, Sergeant.

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Originally posted by Bill N.Y.:
"They (propane people) should know, they fill the tanks" - Ok, fair enough. You're right, they should know.

Should is a word that makes me cringe whenever it is uttered.

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Should is a word that makes me cringe whenever it is uttered.

That word is very common in the National Electrical Code book and is wide open as to interpretation.... Whereas "SHALL" requires compliance.... And believe it or not alot of prople mix those two up...

Yeah, the FAA issued bulletins of varying urgency, too. Mandatory always got everyone's attention. Everything else was a big debate. I would often get a company engineer out of bed to issue a ruling after the FAA had left the office for the day.

I'm glad that this came out into the light for a couple reasons, 1, so I would not ask for thoughts a bout this, and two, for me to look onto seeing how bad off my propane system might be after 22 years. Way too much time and effort into this coach to turn it into a homeland security event.

Bill I like your statement hope we all get the message !!!!!!!!.Now I have a problem I am fixing the leak on the front of the motor . I removed everything off the front that has to be taken off except the damper whice I put on last spring.I can't remember if they are right or left hand .They feel over torqued .Do you know off hand? Also SHOULD I replace the four 17 mm bolts if get them off.I have two torque wrenches and a tank that only goes up to 150lbs. any ideas to get the wrench from not slipping off if you want you can call me would love to talk to you lenny
lenny

We sometimes get exasperated by a problem that is seemingly out of our hands to fix... Sometimes we look for someone to channel our anger to and we misdirect that anger to the person who would like to help - but, being angry at me for something I have no control over is ludicrous.

He might as well complain to me that his phone went dead because a tree fell on the lines.

Sadly for him, his arrogance and attempt at bullying me only led me to post my research about 3 weeks after his "ruined vacation". I had zero desire to help him and I only posted my research on this because I wanted to help anyone else here who may run into this problem.

Lets face it - if he had a problem like this, one of you might have a problem too. It is far better to have this tidbit floating around in your head and not need it.

If you need help ask and we'll try to help...

Wonder why they didn't check with somebody else? There are plenty of places that fill propane tanks, Flying J for one. I have never had an issue and my tanks are old. In Yuma the propane truck comes to me if i don't want to take the bus in.

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Their answer was "They (propane people) should know, they fill the tanks" - Ok, fair enough. You're right, they should know.

Bill NY, with all due respect, I would like to disagree with you somewhat. Let me explain.

An owner/operator of an RV, especially an RV that is more than ten years old, should know or be immediately willing to find out information about all safety concerns of the rig, and should be willing to confirm any individual assertions to be sure that the rig is safe.

There will be tons of metal moving at high speeds. There are hundreds of pounds of fuel. There are ignition sources and asphixiating gases. There are tires, with date codes, load limits, recalls, ozone effects, with sizes that didn't exist when your Barth was first produced. On the P30 chassis, there is a single pump system powering steering and brakes (what could possibly go wrong?). You don't have to spend much time with google searches to find evidence of RV crashes and fires, to be sure that the RV owner/operator doesn't want to repeat that experience.

In terms of the propane tank issue, back around 5 years ago, when I got my Barth, I benefitted by hearing from the knowledgable gentlemen of this forum. I questioned the safety of having a 20 year old propane tank.

Would anyone rely on having a gas pump jockey advise them on gasoline handling safety on their rig? Sure, they should know, they fill the gas tanks. Yet ultimately, the buck stops with the owner/operator of the RV. Learn what it takes to be responsible for the safety of your own rig and your family and other motorists, and of the public safety officers who'd have to rescue you and yours in the event of a problem. Is that gas pump jockey going to be the person that is going to tell you to replace the 20 year old 6" rubber hoses connecting your pump to the steel lines? Is the pump jockey going to tell you not to run a Holley carb because of the risk of bowl gasket leaks?

It takes an unusual focus and level of attention to detail to keep a decades-old RV safely running. I wouldn't have expected that I'd have been such a person to make this happen. Yet with the coaching of Dave B, Bill NY, and the other contributors to this forum, I've been able to do so. A prudent man seeks the counsel of wise men. This has facilitated some of the greatest experiences that my family has benefitted from. But it takes a mindset change, you are not just a driver. You, as the RV O/O, are responsible for all safety matters, and you have to be sure to master these details, or seek the advice of those who have, with sufficient lead time that your travels are happy. Note, I did not add "care-free".

Happy Motoring!
Matt

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Originally posted by Shadow man:
There are plenty of places that fill propane tanks, Flying J for one.

Flying J refusal: A technician named "Clifford" refused to fill the propane tank on our coach. He based his refusal on the fact that our coach is more than 12 years old. (We own a 1993 model.) He said the law says that if the tank is over 12 years old they are not to fill them.

And another one at Flying J: Gary says he hears most complaints about this issue come up when RVers try to fill up at Flying J. His suggestion is if the attendant refuses to fill your motorhome for a "recertification" issue, ask to speak to the manager. If the manager himself is ignorant of the matter, suggest he call the corporate office. That should take care of the problem in short order.

And yet another Flying J issue: Stopped at my local Flying J tonight, on the way home from a camping trip and thought I would get my propane tank refilled. Keep in mind, I have a Class A motorhome with a permanently attached tank, and the motorhome is a 2000 model year which I guess means the tank is about 9 to 10 years old. The "propane service person"... glanced into the compartment and asked if I had an inspection sticker for the tank. I said no and she informed me that tanks have to be inspected at least every 12 years and they had to see the inspection sticker. I suggested that since the coach was only 9 years old that maybe that was good enough but she refused to fill the tank without seeing the sticker.

He never told me where he had an issue - maybe it was a Flying J Travel Plaza.

Only had mine filled once at Flying J and that was last summer, nobody said a thing to me about the age of the tank or the bus. Over on one of the bus boards they have been talking about this subject also. The horizontal rv tanks are a lot thicker walled than the bbq tanks. If you look at home propane tanks, a lot of those are used for decades, i know the one at my parents place was over 40 years old. Don't know if those are ever "inspected" or not.....never saw a tag on it that i can remember.

I had to go back and reread this one. I thought it was about whether you had to re-certify the tanks in our coaches. Some of the stuff was confusing me. I tend to speed read (wish I could speed type). I went back and reread Bill's first post. Bill someone called you and said you were responsible for their messed up vacation because you didn't warn them that we had unsafe tanks in our old Barth's? Which they are not(unsafe).

Being from Minnesnowta anything metal is always prone to severe corrosion from our wonderful salt on the highways. We look at metal if it's eating away it may be unsafe.
I have not been here long but Bill and all the folks here have given me nothing but A-1 advise. When I was on my way home from Yuma Bill took time out of his work day to try to get my tranny rollin after going inoperative. The guy after we were towed fixed it by holding the button down for a couple minutes with nan alarm blaring. Who'd have thunk it.
Sorry Bill nobody should expect you to save us all from ourselves. Thanks for sharing your expertise with us and keeping this invaluable site going for us Barthonians.

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Originally posted by Dana:
Bill someone called you and said you were responsible for their messed up vacation because you didn't warn them that we had unsafe tanks in our old Barth's? Which they are not(unsafe).

He spewed on (or was it a rant?) about how he just bought this coach and the seller should have warned him, I should have had a post about it in our archives and how this should be on the Barth buyers checklist that he paid to get from the cd.

It's odd how some look outward for blame instead of assessing ones own mirror first.

With the 50 dollar words he was tossing around, my guess is he's been in a few courtrooms during his lifetime.

Of course, a 50 dollar word turns into nothing when it's coupled with a few 4 letter words too.

I eventually told him to have a nice day and that he would be in my prayers.

Sorry for the thread drift... But, on an unrelated note, has anyone heard the song Pray for You by Jaron and The Long Road to Love?