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"5+ Years of Active Membership" 9/11 |
I just found out something about my Barth I did not know and that is the Cole-Hersee shut off switch is only shutting off the house batteries and not the engine battery. I have had a drain on the engine battery when the switch was in the both off position and I always thought it to be the LP gas alarm. Recently I replaced all my batteries and several times this month I've had to jump start off my car. The engine would crank freely ,however it would only show 11 volts and would have to jump start it. I took the Barth over to Sams Club thinking the new engine battery defective. They did a complete check and found it to be almost 13 volts with the engine off and sitting about an hour. The tech advise me to do several things in checking for a drain. The first thing I did was disconnect the positive cable and use a trouble light between the battery and the cable. The light lit up dimly and then I tried a meter an it showed a drain. I then hooked the cable back on and checked each fuse for a drain and found none. When checking back by the engine I found the Cole-Hersee switch is only shutting off the house batteries and not the engine battery. When rotating the switch you can hear a relay work from the both-on to the first click shut off,however on the second click (both-off position)there is no relay sound. In the picture the one relay is marked CB1 and the other CB2. CB1 seems to be the one working and the other one is not. No matter were the switch is set there is current to all the red wires (top & bottom) of both relays. There is no current to the one red wire which is to the bottom left (bolted to the side)except when I place the aux.start dash switch in the on position. So far I have cleaned every ground I have found and have cleaned a "lot" of connections including taking the Cole-Hersee off and cleaning those connections. Since I am not very knowledgeable in the electrical field, I am at a loss of what to do. The inside of that box looks like it needs an expert to work on the problem.  Thanks for any suggestions, Jim 1985 Barth Regency 35ft DD 225hp All trans 4 speed | ||
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"Host" of Barthmobile.com 1/19 |
Jim, Those are not relays. Those items are high amperage "Circuit Breakers" hence the designation "CB". These are made to pass current and have nothing to do with power drainage issues. [edit:9:47pm] Just got off the phone with Jim - he's sending me more pictures so I can get a better understanding of what he's up against.
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| 4/08 |
I have the same problem on our Breakaway. If sitting for a month and not plugged in the coach batteries will be discharged. One draw is the transmission control module as it requires full time 12vdc to maintain what it has learned. I unhook the batteries if it is going to be stored for any length of time. '92 Barth Breakaway - 30' 5.9 Cummins (6B) 300+ HP 2000 Allison Front entrance | |||
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| "Host" of Barthmobile.com 1/19 |
I'm leaving to go to a friends house now - I'll post some more when I get home.
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3/23 |
Not much draw but there i s s draw from my volt meters which are always on. There is also a very small drain for the memory in the radio. None of this is significant for intermittently used toys but when left for a month or so they can get cranky, sorry poor choice of word. | |||
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7/17 |
A few months ago I got was helping a freind that was having about the same problem with his L10 powered SOB. On a return trip from Fla. he had charging problems and the Tech in Macon Ga. replaced his 3 wire alternator with a 1 wire Neece-nevell alternator. Lost Tach and cruise. could not charge thru isolator. Had to jump isolator to get coach battery to charge and disconect to keep from draining battery. After Exchanging the 1 wire alt. for a 3 wire to get the proper AC taps off the alt. for the tach, rewiring back to stock. No more battery drain, and charges fine thru isolator. tach and cruise work. You may want to disconect your alternator and see if this is where your drain is from. Doorman 1986 31' Regal -1976 Class C 454/T400 P30 -350/T400 G30 twin cntr beds - 21' rear bath | |||
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| "Host" of Barthmobile.com 1/19 |
If it gets hot - then yes, it is drawing power. We did a writeup on several ways to disconnect power and current draw while not in use. I'm not a fan of that type of relay you have because of the fact it is constantly drawing power. http://barthmobile.com/eve/for...061/m/5911097361/p/1 I would either use a latching relay or a master disconnect switch. If you go the route of a latching relay then you'll be able to leave the switch on longer and use less amperage. You have certain things that always draw power, like clocks and radio memory, so you might never totally eliminate all current drain.
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| "5+ Years of Active Membership" 9/11 |
Thanks for the response from Bill(NY) and Doorman. I tried Doorman's suggestion. I disconnected my positive lead from the engine battery and then disconnected the positive wire from the alternator. I used my test light and there wasn't any drain between the positive side of the engine battery and the positive cable. Next step- I hooked the cable back onto the engine battery. I felt the battery/starter relay and it remained cool. I turned the Cole-Hersee switch from the both-off position to the halfway position and I heard the relay click. This is opposite from when the alternator wire is hooked up. ((NOTE: with the alt. wire hooked up the Cole-Hersee switch would make the battery/starter relay click when moved from the both-on position to the halfway and no sound then to the both-off position.)) I then moved it to the both-on position (no sound from the relay) and felt the battery/starter relay and it was still cool. Should I go back to the original style alternator and hook up(?) and the original style battery isolator (?) Is it possible that the battery/starter relay is defective ? Maybe it's time for an electrical shop to look at it. Any more suggestions....  Jim | |||
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| "5+ Years of Active Membership" 9/11 |
I tried searching out my problem today and you guys can dis-regard my statment about the relay clicking a certain way. I found out it made a difference which way the Cole-Hersee switch is rotated. When in position 2 the house batteries are on and at off position the house batteries are off. When in position 1 the engine battery is on and the battery/starter relay gets hot. In both-on position the engine battery(& house battery) are on and the battery/starter relay gets hot. In position 2 the engine battery is on(& house battery) and the battery/starter relay gets hot. In the off position the engine battery is on(& the house battery is off) and the battery/starter relay is cool. Is the battery/starter relay magnetic? I ask this because with the engine and house batteries dis-connected the relay clicks when the Cole-Hersee switch is rotated. I just thought of something about that question, the Barth was plugged into shore power when it did this, would that make it click? Still can't find anything except when the alternator positive wire is dis-connect the drain stops. Jim | |||
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1/12 |
Jim: I'll call you tomorrow................. Former owner of "THE TOY" 1988 Barth Regal SE 33' Tag 1992 Barth Breakaway 32' 2005 Coachmen Mirada 32' DS | |||
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| "5+ Years of Active Membership" 9/11 |
More info on my battery draining down. After checking everything a second & third time I decided to drive up to Venice and have an expert check it. I put a battery charger on it overnight and after a little cranking it started up and away I went. The alternator showed charging 13 volts at first and then went up to 13.5 volts. After a little while it went up to almost 14 volts and by the time I got to the service garage it was just about 14.2 volts and that was the highest I had ever seen it go. Don, the owner of the shop, went over everything putting jumpers and by-pass cables from one area to another. Turning the engine off and then back on. Then the alternator started acting up and he removed it for a bench test and the thing quit putting out any voltage. So a new alternator was put on. Another couple of load tests were made and the problem was found. The new battery I had purchased from Sams Club had a defective cell which would go almost dead under a load start. The draw that I was having was normal just like Bill of NY stated and added to the defective cell. Don conducting these tests said he thinks that is why the alternator was putting out high volts and is probably why the alternator gave up. Sams Club got the battery back and I put in a new Interstate HD battery. I barely touch the key now and she's starts right up. That relay still gets warm but only when the Cole-Hersee switch is in the both-on position. Also my steps which quit working while I had my problem are now working with the new Interstate battery. Jim  | |||
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Glassnose Aficionado 2/09 |
Jim, was that Don's Battery Outlet on Venice Ave? Sounds like you finally got things right. I've talked to Don about the coach when I bring in core batteries [$3 each] but I've never had it in there. 79 Barth Classic | |||
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| "5+ Years of Active Membership" 9/11 |
Danny, Yes! it is Don's Battery Outlet on Venice Ave. I went there because in 2002 I had a charging problem and he quickly corrected it. The one Sam's Club manager was ok in refunding my money and the other one just wanted to replace the battery and made the comment "I doubt that your alternator went out because of the battery". I did not ask they refund me for a new alternator. With his attitude I should have and write Sam's main office. When I first put the Sam's batttery in I had problems. I went back they ran a quick check and said nothing wrong with your battery you must have something draining it down. The manager at that time said we don't have any replacement batteries that size and yet had two on the battery rack. So much for that. Just glad I'm up and running again. Jim | |||
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