Hi
I just ordered new airbags for the front. Last pair (Airlift) only lasted 5 years. I decided to try Firestone this time. The material of these seem to be very different almost like that of a plastic gas can. I have no idea how I'm going to twist these up and get them through that small hole in the a frame. Has anyone had any luck with the firestone airbags?
Thanks,
Lloyd

You might consider dropping the lower A arm and removing the spring for insertion.

Whatever you do, do NOT disconnect it at its inner end. I helped a guy get it back together after he did that, and it was no fun. He saw a car wrench show and said it looked easier than breaking the ball joint loose. Maybe with a car, but not a P30.

I loaned him my ball joint tool and the other side went easily. I don't remember what bag he used, but it was a cold winter week and he wanted to do it.

I raised the front to stretch the spings out as far as they would go, then threaded the bags through the coils. LOTS of Vaseline. Not easy, but got them in. The right one is shot already,[about 5 years]. I'll be interested in the Firestones if I decide to replace them. Cost? I remember the Airlifts being about 60 bucks.

My son & I recently replaced springs and bags on his P32, requiring us to drop the lower arm. While I've replaced my own bags through the bottom hole in the past, I'm inclined to drop the arm next time.....
It wasn't near as difficult as I imagined. IE: jack up & stabilize, disconnect lower shock mount, disconnect
tie rod & sway bar, support the lower arm w/ jack and back-off on lower spindle nut, slowly lowering the whole arm.
The spring just falls out and is relatively easy to insert bag and remount spring. A couple observations:

1. Tapered shaft on lower ball joint needs smacking w/ BIG hammer to free up - use sledge. (We spent wasted time beating it w/ 16 oz hammer)

2. For safety, keep spindle nut on shaft so assembly doesn't "explode" apart - spring has only about 3" of travel before it's relaxed, but there's LOTS of energy being stored there.

3. Floor jack supporting lower arm should be perpendicular to coach so it can roll and follow the radius
swing of the lower arm as it's dropped.

My next air bag R&R will be done this way......

Good info at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...ture=player_embedded

quote:

Originally posted by Lee:
My son & I recently replaced springs and bags on his P32, requiring us to drop the lower arm.

I think most of the P32 Chassis coaches could probably benefit from new front springs. Price em out and see - if you've got to go through the same amount of labor replacing the bags... then, springs might be worth your consideration.

Lee, what was the price you paid for the springs? Part numbers?

I put Firestone airbags in the coils of the 86 Regal a couple weeks ago. No need to remove suspension parts!
Raise front end to unload the coil. (Makes installation easier when coils are further apart)
Put airbag in hot water, then roll up as small as you can by hand.
Use hose clamps (about 3 or so) to further collapse the roll. (A screw gun with hex socket helps here)
Push the bag through the hole in the bottom A arm. Remove the 1st clamp and move it further down the bag. Leap-frog your way along with the clamps..with the screw gun it only takes a few minutes.
I also found it easier to insert the top spacer between the coils just before the bag was fully in. good luck
I think I got this from some previous post on this site?

quote:

I think I got this from some previous post on this site?

Yep, that's the way I did it the first time....but the spring R&R project makes me think that dropping the lower arm is as-easy if not easier....For sure, lots less grunting....Your mileage may vary......

Bill NY, I'll get info on springs...it was son's project, so I only saw what came out of the box. We did it because the coach had a distinct list on driver's side....new springs,new bags, new Monroes, new sway bar and new Steer Safe....alignment next....On-the-road-again

I am also interested in the spring replacements (weight rating, source and price). I haven't gotten into chassis height, etc but I will soon. Also interested in comments on the sway bar results.

Thanks for all the input.
Here's the deal. These are very rigid, not at all like the previous ones which I could roll up rather easily. They are blue and as you flatten to roll up it kind of creases and changes color much like a piece of plastic. Don't seem to absorbent or spring like.
I like the idea of air assist so I can adjust the ride.

quote:

Originally posted by shtym:

I like the idea of air assist so I can adjust the ride.

Adjusting the front air bags up and down is not good. Your alignment guy needs to get both the front and rear ride height correct before he sets caster. Once he sets it, you need to keep it at the correct height to have correct caster.

Caster is vewy, vewy important to keep P30s handling well. The Pee chassis is extremely intolerant of incorrect caster, particularly not enough. Be sure your coach is set to motor home specs, not potato-chip truck specs. If your front end man doesn't know about the MH specs, go somewhere else.

The bad rap the Pee has gotten for poor handling is mostly from spring sag, incorrect ride height and poor alignment.

The only thing I can add to this post is if you removed the lower control arm is make it much easier to inspect the ball joints and other bushings for wear and play. Its also a good time to replace them.

My P30 does not have any front air bags. I assume the previous owner removed them and replaced the spring with aftermarket units. The springs look heavier than other OEM one I have seen. It rides fine and the front ride height is very close to specs. I adjust side to side with rear air bags.

I think dropping the arm is a good idea because it allows you to add grease and check ball joints as Neil stated...but if I was just adding bags I'd go through the bottom:

When you get to the end like so...

...open the valve which allows the bag to expand inside the spring making it easier to place the top spacer (coat the bottom of the spacer with vaseline to help hold it in place). Then put the valve back on and use a bottle jack to push up the remaining inch or so spraying it with silicone as you go (put some type of protection between the bag and bottle jack so you don't puncture it). Then slide the bottom spacer through the coil and pry it into place.

This is where I got my springs:
http://www.stengelbros.com/SuperDutyCoilSprings.htm

I got the ones rated for 4289 lbs (my front end weighs 4700 lbs) and they added a few inches to my ride height. I don't think bags are even needed now but I had them so I put them in anyway.

I also added the Hellwig sway bar which I would definitely recommend.

Ball joint are best checked with everything together.

I can scan the factory shop manual pages for any contributing member.

One other item that helps immensely with this job...



CURSING...

quote:

Originally posted by K&E:
One other item that helps immensely with this job...



CURSING...

You gotta be careful with that.

I was not really aware that I cursed much, but apparently I did. My dad was out visiting, and came in to report that my two year old son was outside, "Working" on his trike, with the wooden tools I had made for him.

My father observed (somewhat astounded), "He not only knows all the words, but he has them in the right place."

Naturally, I was quite chagrined to know that my two year old son knew all the words it took me a coupla decades to collect, and soon cleaned up my act.

Somewhat, anyway.