Amen, brother Dale!!
Jim

Not all who wander are lost.

A drop of ink may make a million think.

The bike still works and felt good in the breeze. JKB

I'm not yelling that the sky is falling or saying that it's all going to pot. What I am saying is that it's not just the fuel that will go up it's everything tied to it.

Alot of companies are adding fuel surcharges and increasing there prices. What I have a hard time with is that it seems that the pay checks will not rise at the same rate as everything around it.

Fuel prices have increased about 40% in less then a year. I don't think anyone here has gotten that kind of pay raise.

Lets take a trucks operating expense of fuel, oil, tires etc... All of this is tied to oil. So its not just fuel alone here.

Look around you, most everything we have was delivered by a truck. Anyone that buys a apple or refrigerator or whatever will pay more across the board for just about everything.

Lets take the ripple effect here and for everyone that decides not to take that 2nd little add on vacation that money is not going to the owner of a campground or the vendors that sell at the county fair.

Read Olroys post about how things are changing for him and his community. Daves making less trips in his Barth. I hope that things will be ok, but lets not kid ourselves. As I stated before... Time will tell.

Ps. I always think that the glass is half full.

[This message has been edited by Bill (edited August 18, 2005).]

Well lets see.... i am making 50% more here in Wa. than i was making in Az. 6 months ago. However when i left Wa. 4 years ago i took a 33% paycut, ( $30 to $20 back to $30 an hour) so now i am still making the same as four years ago even tho i am making 50% more than i have made during the last four years. Hmmmm now what were fuel prices like four years ago? And last nite i saw that inflation had just taken a 1% jump, bet it will jump more in the coming months before things settle down. When we were living on Maui fuel prices slowly kept rising until they hit about $1.84 a gal. even tho prices on the mainland had peaked at about $1.50 and gone back down below $1.00. People started asking why our prices had not gone down....supposedly because there are only 2 refineries over there but when they started talking about a state investigation prices overnite dropped 14 cents a gallon and at least one gas chain changed names ( "new ownership") but i think they just did that so they could say that "They" weren't the ones responsible for gouging the public. Its all a racket, they are going to try to get the highest prices that they can for as long as they can using any excuse they can find to justify it until people start complaining and then they will back off on the price part way to appease everyone but prices will never go back down to the previous levels. Just wait and watch and see. My glass is have full too.....it just costs me more.

Here in Minnesota they just increased the tax on a pack of cigarettes by $.75. But that gave cities the OK to do their part so a pack went up really $1.00-1.15 a pack. I don't smoke nor does anyone in my family so I don't care much. But there was much discussion about how much can they charge for a pack before people would start smuggling in untaxed cigs from Tanzania or someplace.

I am sure that all of the oil companies and oil pumping nations have armies of CPA's researching this exact thing 24 hours a day. They are equally desirous for us to keep up the buying as they are in keeping the prices up.

My biggest concern for our country and way of life in the US is not the price of gas however, it is the amount of debt that people carry. Try these 2002 stats on for size;

Total consumer credit: $1.7 trillion.
Credit card debt carried by the average American: $8,562.
Total finance charges Americans paid in 2001: $50 billion.
Percent of U.S. households deemed credit worthy by the lending industry: 78%.
Number of credit card holders who declared bankruptcy last year: 1.3 million
Average interest rate 18.9%

However, can Americans make a decision to not travel to the beach or the lake to save a gallon of gas but we can't force ourselves to not buy the XBox for the kid or go to Apple bee's and whip out the Visa.

Bottom line here is that because of debt, Americans are enslaving themselves and reducing their options in response to things like higher fuel price.

"St. Peter don't ya call me cause I can't go I owe my soul to the company store".

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[This message has been edited by davebowers (edited August 18, 2005).]

According to the U.S. National Debt Clock, on 18 Aug., 2005, at 04:51:04 PM GMT, our national debt was $7,908,162, 238,626.19, in other words, pushing $8 trillion, and growing at the rate of $1.64 billion per day. Each individual's share was $26,646.63, about 3 times the average personal credit card debt that Dave mentions.

Our governrnent debt worries me far more than personal debt. The only way to pay off government debt is through taxes.

The most profligate Federal borrowers since World War II, Ronald Reagan, & George W. Bush, borrowed that money to replace revenues lost from tax cuts that gave the greatest benefits to the wealthiest among us. The only President in recent years to balance a budget and create a surplus was "tax & spend" Democrat Bill Clinton.

There is an "Alice in Wonderland" aspect to the common perception that Republicans are fiscal conservatives while Democrats are fiscally irresponsible. The facts demonstrate the opposite.


[This message has been edited by olroy (edited August 18, 2005).]

quote:

Originally posted by bubbiebarth2:

quote:

Originally posted by davebowers:
[b]Here in Minnesota they just increased the tax on a pack of cigarettes by $.75. But that gave cities the OK to do their part so a pack went up really $1.00-1.15 a pack. I don't smoke nor does anyone in my family so I don't care much. But there was much discussion about how much can they charge for a pack before people would start smuggling in untaxed cigs from Tanzania or someplace.

I am sure that all of the oil companies and oil pumping nations have armies of CPA's researching this exact thing 24 hours a day. They are equally desirous for us to keep up the buying as they are in keeping the prices up.

My biggest concern for our country and way of life in the US is not the price of gas however, it is the amount of debt that people carry. Try these 2002 stats on for size;

Total consumer credit: $1.7 trillion.
Credit card debt carried by the average American: $8,562.
Total finance charges Americans paid in 2001: $50 billion.
Percent of U.S. households deemed credit worthy by the lending industry: 78%.
Number of credit card holders who declared bankruptcy last year: 1.3 million
Average interest rate 18.9%

However, can Americans make a decision to not travel to the beach or the lake to save a gallon of gas but we can't force ourselves to not buy the XBox for the kid or go to Apple bee's and whip out the Visa.

Bottom line here is that because of debt, Americans are enslaving themselves and reducing their options in response to things like higher fuel price.

[b]"St. Peter don't ya call me cause I can't go I owe my soul to the company store".

[/B]

What really worries me is the debt our GROVERNMENT is ammazing.Local & National:Yes,we are paying for the "LOCAL" our tax on our house went up about 239% this year!


[/B]

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Jay&Shelby 95 Barth Regency 34ft. 8.3 Cummins 300 hp.
Spartan K2 MM.

I apologize to everyone for injecting something that could be construed as a political statement. I made that mistake once before and I think that was an error on my part; big time. Regardless of the causes, high gas prices suck for me and I suspect everyone else.

Regardsless of your politics, I luv ya all and I still want Dale Smith's coach.

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Olroy, You're my new hero!! I avoid getting into politics with anybody, especially those I don't know personally, but you hit the nail on the head and say true, say thankya!

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Dan & Suzy Z
'81 Euro 28

Hey Dave, don't sweat it. It gives us a chance to bleed a little bit about something that direly affects all of us who soon may be calculating our operating costs in dollars per mile.

Sometimes your at the top of the wheel other times your under it. We are now moving in a downward direction. I just hope that the economy has enough forward momentum to keep going forward.

I will be sending my part $26,646.63 to Dave for his great web site. I would at least know that it would be put to good use.

Ps. If I did that would I have to donate again?

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http://www.truckroadservice.com/

quote:

Originally posted by davebowers:
I apologize to everyone for injecting something that could be construed as a political statement. I made that mistake once before and I think that was an error on my part; big time. Regardless of the causes, high gas prices suck for me and I suspect everyone else.

Regardsless of your politics, I luv ya all and I still want Dale Smith's coach.

Dave: I didn't take it the wrong way: High prices on everythings suck for us too!You don't need a high "IQ" to know something is wrong here!We are digging a deep hole and getting in deep "do/do!Yes Olroy I miss "SLICK WILLIE" !Regardsless of your politics this is about our way of life and our Country!

------------------
Jay&Shelby 95 Barth Regency 34ft. 8.3 Cummins 300 hp.
Spartan K2 MM.

[This message has been edited by bubbiebarth2 (edited August 18, 2005).]

OK How about some ideas about something we as a group can do? I'm not talking about individual action--that will happen. Can we as a group send some communication to people in government or industry that we're mad as **** and expect them to do something--like an investigation into price gouging at the highest level-- how about some ideas? If we do something, maybe it will make us feel better.

Yeah, I have something we all can do..... Quit drinking the right-wing CoolAid and like OlRoy says look at the facts.....Look at the Congressional Reports, if you want the easy way, watch CSPAN... Use your brain..... I was the farthest to the right you could imagine, until "Ray-gun" torpedod me..... Does anyone remember his " Well I guess it looks like we're crooks, so I guess we are" speech.. His second term he was lost in Altzheimer's and I can't belive how few f us picked up on it. GHW Bush said Wolfwitz' PNAC stuff was "INSANE" but, "W" Carried the project on... and attacked Iraq. So, here all of us proud Barth owners are, and the **** things aren't worth a dime because gasoline is three dollars a gallon. Some of us realise the problem... others still think Dubya is the Messiah... Well, they should Google lots of things for the next few days... Here's a start: "Robin Lowman"..
Cheers, and cheaper fuel to us all,
John

I had a chat with our Scotland office this morning; gas in the UK is $9.00 dollars a gallon. Now they have VAT and that kicks all prices up quite a bit. The price of gas appears to impact places other than the ones we see on a daily basis.

The times they are a changing, I am not too sure our local, U.S.A., political structure has much of an effect on things one way or the other. I am glad to see we as a group take an interest in how we can formulate change but may I suggest a search for "Peak Oil" on the net.

My view is that there are too many of us but sadly I do not see a rationing model that will allow the status quo nor can I propose a solution that is not draconian.

Some how if I began to sport a bumper sticker that says "War is not the solution, genocide is" I fear I would find myself is a series of very aukward situations that will do little to move us to a workable living model.

I hope I am not adding oil to the fire:
Timothy