Hello,

I am a new reader and am enjoying all the great knowledge and experience shared on this web site.

I am purchasing a 1972 Barth with a 350 ci engine.
The seller tells me that the alternator belt must be replaced (apparently, it is missing), but that the engine runs, even if he has been charging the batteries to keep them alive.

My question is, what is the proper technique and attack for replacing the alternator belt? From the pictures the owner sent me, it looks as if the job must be performed from inside the cabin, over the engine, and from behind the engine? That seems a little strange to me.

Is it not better to lift the vehicle with a floor jack, and do the job from below? Or, is that not possible?

If that is the case, what rating would I need (weight-wise) to lift a 25-foot(?) Barth sufficiently, in order to change the alternator belt.

I have about a week before I travel to go pickup this 1972 Barth in Ohio. I'll be traveling in a Winebago Rialta, so there will be some room to carry a floor jack, and other tools.

Any recommendations on how to do this job?

I will include a photo, for a reference.



Thank you!
Tim Grimes
Knoxville, TN

1) work from above, inside the coach.
2) Alternator has two bolts holding it in place: one into the engine through an ear on the bottom center of the alternator, the other through a curved support arm -on the top- into the alternator itself. The support arm is about 1/8" thick curving up from left to right; the slot in the arm allows the alternator to slide and tighten the belt.
3) Loosen top bolt; don't remove it because the washer allowing it to slide will fall off; loosen the bottom bolt and entire alternator will rotate to the left, with the upper bolt sliding in the open slot in the support arm. This may take some muscle, but not much -NO PRY BARS! Both boltheads take 9/16" wrench, unless slot wrench takes 1/2". Since you're working blind, use a closed-end wrench; it's unlikely you'll have front-to-back room for a ratchet.
4) Engine crankshaft pulley -big, bottom front- has 3 or 4 grooves: P/S, Water pump, alternator; alt will be the outside/front groove. Give wife a flashlight and and have her lie down underneath and put the belt into groove when you lower it from above (your marriage will be enhanced if you give her safety glasses before she does this, as automotive crud will fall into her eyes, nose, mouth...). Put the belt over the pulley, gently pry/pull alt to the right until belt is tight, then tighten the upper (slot) bolt. Next tighten the lower bolt and finis coronat opus.
PS: The job is real easy; reaching the bolts is awkward, and you're working blind. Good luck

Caveats - Be sure the alternator belt does not also drive other accessories, and be sure it is in the proper groove in the lower pulley. If all the other accessories are properly belted, and one crankshaft groove is devoted only to the alternator as Gunner suggests, you can't make a mistake. If the alternator belt drives other accessories, it gets complicated, and you need to be careful of belt alignment. That can be determined by placing a straight edge along the face of a pulley, and sighting along it to be sure it aligns with the next one. Easier said than done than in the confines of a motorhome engine compartment. Good luck.

In addition to Gunner's comments, I would use a good heavy duty screwdriver as a pry bar to tighten the belt unless you are Hercules. The alternator belt will fly off or shred itself if the pulleys are not aligned or rusty. I would bring some plumbers tape (80 grit emory type sandpaper on a narrow strip) to remove rust from pulleys. Also, a good flourescent shop light would be great help topside. A good cushion or thick towel over the air cleaner makes it more comfortable.

Double ditto to Ed's comments about rusty pulleys. Been there, done that.

Thanks Gunner, OlRoy, and Ed,

I'll make sure to bring along some protective glasses for my wife. Good call. I'll bring along a good tool kit, including the closed-end wrenches, sandpaper, and some solvent for the bolts on the alternator. I really appreciate all this excellent advice.

Be sure to buy a good belt. Some are a little narrow, and will bottom out in the pulley groove, causing slipping under high electrical loads. I have seen good mechanics go crazy over this.

I use genuine Gates with good results.

NAPA sells a nice tension checking tool.

The current owner of this 1972 Barth sent me the following information about the belt.

"As far as the belt goes, I found the one that was on the vehicle when I bought it. It is a Gates 8435 Extra Service belt. It has two identifying numbers on the belt, ES2 and (225S). I also found some packaging in a drawer on the RV that may have come with this belt, but I can’t be sure. The packaging reads ‘Drive Rite Automotive v-belt” with a number of 43513 and 15435DR. The engine is a GM 350. The only tricky part I see with installing a new belt is that it is not the easiest area to get to. Also, this engine has a post-factory high performance cooling fan on the engine which looks like some adjustments were made to the spacing of the alternator from the engine to ensure alignment of the belt path. This is just my theory, we can look into further once you get here." - seller

********

Do any of you know about these "extra service belts" (by Gates)? Do any of the other numbers (listed below) mean anything I need to know? Anyone ever use those Gates models? I'm assuming that the seller is talking about part numbers versus model numbers, or something on that order. I agree with Bill H on Gates being excellent quality though, but I've seen some fairly robust looking belts from AutoZone "Gatorback?", or something of that order.

If any of you have any other recommendations, I thank you in advance.

I'm also assuming that it would be a good idea to drain all the fluids (oil, tranny, brake fluid, perhaps engine coolant), and replace everything before we drive the rig back home. Any other recommendations?

Thanks gents!
Tim

What I'd do: Replace oil & filter; replace Trans fluid; drain radiator and refill with new coolant. This coach may have a fuel filter in-line in the stainless fuel line running along the inside of the pass-side chassis framerail (round, about 1-1/2" in dia attached to stainless fuel line by neoprene tubing about 1" long); if so I'd change that before I left OH-high-OH, along with the carb filter. Note the carb body filter probably only goes in one way. Both filters are readily avail at Pep Boys or the Ohio equivalent. When I got home to Georgia I'd change oil & filter (yeah,again); change trans fluid and filter and replace the trans shift actuator (on the pass side of the TH400); drain, flush, and fill the radiator with new coolant; and change the brake fluid.

And change the differential oil.

Actually, since the front belt is off, I'd replace ALL the belts.

And change the differential oil.
Actually, since the front belt is off, I'd replace ALL the belts.

As usual, the Sailor is right. Be aware the P/S bracket has a bolt -into the block- hidden out of sight that must be loosened before the pump can be rotated to replace the belt. It's hard to see, and even harder to get to.

quote:

Be aware the P/S bracket has a bolt -into the block- hidden out of sight that must be loosened before the pump can be rotated to replace the belt. It's hard to see, and even harder to get to.

I submit this as a formidable entry in the Yet-to-be-Announced Barthmobile Forum "Understatement of the Year" Contest. The P/S belt is surely the most fiddly I've ever dealt with...and it can be adjusted only from underneath. Soley the rear bolt on the fuel pump can contend.

quote:

Originally posted by Rusty:
And change the differential oil.

Actually, since the front belt is off, I'd replace ALL the belts.

What is the best differential oil to use in a Barth?

quote:

Originally posted by Rusty:

quote:

Be aware the P/S bracket has a bolt -into the block- hidden out of sight that must be loosened before the pump can be rotated to replace the belt. It's hard to see, and even harder to get to.

I submit this as a formidable entry in the Yet-to-be-Announced Barthmobile Forum "Understatement of the Year" Contest. The P/S belt is surely the most fiddly I've ever dealt with...and it can be adjusted only from underneath. Soley the rear bolt on the fuel pump can contend.

Thanks! Great information. I do believe, however, that I will wait-out the P/S belt based on your "Understatement of the Year." As a Peugeot owner, I have had a few experiences as such, and I may wait until I get home for that venture. But...your recommendation is wise. I'll bring along all belts and change them all, if they look dry or at all worn.

quote:

Originally posted by Tim Grimes:

What is the best differential oil to use in a Barth?

It depends on the diffy. I use Amsoil synthetic in my Breakaway (with a Dana 80); in my SOB with a GM rear axle, Kendall Elite.