I've a Kohler Klunker 3.6 KW in StaRV II. Because I boondock a lot, I'm not happy with

a) Fuel consumption (only get about 30 hrs run time on LPG, even though the tank is fairly generous at 29 nominal, 25 useful)

b) Noise. Most of the boondocking I do is at star parties, and noise is considered tres' gauche

I'm considering switching to a small diesel (liquid-cooled) or the Honda EV-4010 (twin cylinder liquid cooled), in which case I would add a 20-30 gal tank for gaso (40-60 hours run time) rather than converting it to run on LPG. I have plenty of weight reserve on the front axle...

I considered the Onans, but they're considerably more expensive than the Hondas, and I think not worth the extra costs.

Suggestions, speculations, and/or experiences would be appreciated.

The Hondas EVs are nice. I bought one, but have not installed it yet, as I finally got my Kohler Klanker running right. However, the Honda is going in there sometime. I'm not sure I would buy a 4k EV, as it is the same size, weight and noise as the 6k, and costs almost as much. Only a couple of parts are different. Probably field or something, I forgot. I have the parts manual if you are interested. Even if you have only one air conditioner, the 6k just gives you more headroom, such as a big IOTA charger when the microwave and AC are running, for example. I am a believer in big chargers for high amp bulk charging and short running time to save gas and noise. I only charge bulk when out.

My own feelings are that in the 4k range, the Onan microlite is worth looking at. It is the quietest I have measured, as it has its own sound suppression package, unlike the Honda. When installed with a little care toward quietness, it is really nice. The Honda requires the installer to do the soundproofing. That will not be hard for me, as mine sits in a box. I haven't seen yours, but is it in a box? The EV HOndas breathe and exhaust through the bottom, so quietening is fairly easy. I recall many diesel Barths I have seen let genset noise out through the grille. In fact, the Barth was noisier with the same genset as an SOB. CC maybe, I forgot.

We are pretty much solar, and only run the genset for toasters, blender, microwave, and charging if unter den linden. No TV, etc.

We have two air conditioners, both 13.5. I am considering replacing the bedroom AC with a Coleman Polar Cub and powering it with a Honda 2000 at night. Our last outing saw 103 during the day, so we are rethinking our night sleeping arrangement in the desert or Colorado river. Our swampy was compromised by the humidity.

quote:

Originally posted by bill h:
...if unter den linden.

Our swampy was compromised by the humidity.

Bill H. et al

One of the things I like about this site is all of the new words and phrases I get to learn. Some is pig latin and real latin while others are old school (your dating yourself) and obscure.

I remember reading that most newspapers write there stories so that a 5th grader could read them.

Some of the phrases and words that are listed here show me how the command (or lack there of) of the english language really does affect (or is it effect? I guess it could be both depending upon how this is answered.) how others view the people they are talking (typing) to or are reading about.

I remember that some of my favorite reading in 5th grade was Readers Digest "It pays to enrich your word power"

Unter den Linden (Under the Lindens – named for its linden or lime trees (also known in North America as basswood trees) which line the grassed pedestrian mall between the two carriageways) is one of Berlin's best-known streets.

Ok, I got that you were saying under the trees. So, what is a swampy (I'm guessing a boat?) and why would you care if the humidity compromised it?

Swampy:

boggy: (of soil) soft and watery; "the ground was boggy under foot"; "a marshy coastline"; "miry roads"; "wet mucky lowland"; "muddy barnyard"; "quaggy terrain"; "the sloughy edge of the pond"; "swampy bayous"
wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn

Swampy (real name Daniel Hooper) is a British environmental protester, or eco-warrior. He became a nationally known figure after spending a week in a complex series of tunnels dug in the path of a new extension to the A30 road in Stanworth, resisting attempts at eviction by police. Several people took part in the protest, but Swampy was the last one evicted. Mr Hooper was originally from Newbury, Berkshire, the site of the protest over the Newbury bypass in 1996.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swampy

Describes an aroma similar to stagnant water or sewer gas. This smell can often be due to a temporary condition or state of the wine, with the wine becoming more appealing with time.
www.grape-nutz.com/tastings/glossary.html

Old style spot cooler. You add water or ice to it to allow spot cooling. Good in very low to no humidity areas.

Bill N.Y.

El Segundo Bill is talking about a "swamp cooler," more accurately, an "evaporative cooler," a method of cooling familiar to most Southwesterners, but seldom found in humid Northern & Eastern climes.

It relies on the cooling effect of evaporating water by drawing air over water-soaked pads. It's only effective in low humidity. When the humidity is up, the evaporation doesn't cool much, but adds to the humidity indoors.

If you're old enough to remember when most autos came without A/C, you'll remember a swamp cooler accessory that hung in a window.

Click!



You know, come to think of it, I remember my parents Chevy van with a roof mounted cooler. They would add water to it and then drive down the road. It seldom worked well. We use to pop open the back windows and would rather deal with the exhaust then getting overheated.

Bill N.Y.

quote:

Originally posted by olroy:
El Segundo Bill is talking about a "swamp cooler," more accurately, an "evaporative cooler," a method of cooling familiar to most Southwesterners, but seldom found in humid Northern & Eastern climes.

It relies on the cooling effect of evaporating water by drawing air over water-soaked pads. It's only effective in low humidity. When the humidity is up, the evaporation doesn't cool much, but adds to the humidity indoors.

THIS is what I was referring to. It is a proprietary name for an evaporative or "swamp" cooler. Pretty good unit when it's dry. Unfortunately, we were near the Mohave river, and there was irrigation, so it was not in its best environment.

quote:

If you're old enough to remember when most autos came without A/C, you'll remember a swamp cooler accessory that hung in a window.

Yeah, it's amazing what those things are worth now. Not only for period show cars or Route 66 events, but the Latino car guys here in El Lay are really into late 40s and early 50s Chebbies, and one of those really sets it off. I have even seen newly manufactured dummy units.

I'm considering the TurboKool

bill h, how effective is the Swampy, and how do you hook it up (run the exhaust through a window or something?)

I agree the Microlite is extremely quiet, but the Honda EV is also very quiet compared to the Kohler...actually, The Anvil Chorus is quiet compared to the Klunker. I've tried placing high density foam at different places around the Kohler to see if any noise can be suppressed, but according to my soundmeter, the engine is so intrinsically noisy, the sound comes from everywhere.

And I just don't see a $2K difference for the Onan over the Hondas.

Rusty,
why not just leave in the genset you have now for times when noise isn't an issue and you want the convenience of a push button, start from in the coach unit, and perhaps buy a small suitcase style genset that you can run off a hundred feet or so of extension cord? I've got a 3kw Honda in my genset slideout, but most of the time all I need is to keep the coach batteries charged up and run a radio and small appliances, so I use an old Honda half KW job that is quiet, fuel efficient, and takes up very little storage space. I also keep a halogen spotlight with it so I can quickly shine some light on a level parking spot when arriving at the boondock site in the evening. Just a thought, some guys don't want to carry two things that do the same thing, and others want to have two of everything. Guess which one I am?

I've considered the Honda portables (which are REALLY quiet), but space in the Breakaway is squeezed when I pack up the astrogear, so squeezed, in fact, I'm considering a small trailer. Or a 32' Regency (but the 28' is perfect for my needs).

The Honda 3 KW portable would be just right, but where do I put it....?

Rusty may I suggest the Honda 4010. Thats whats in mine and it is quite but most important reliable and efficient. Runs everthing at once with no problem and not heavily loaded down. I talked to a Honda dealer thats worked on them forever. He told me its not uncommon to see them with 10000 hours. See if you get that out of Onan . Can find them new for 2200.00.

Thanks, bigcat - do you run yours on gasoline or did you do the LPG conversion?

quote:

Originally posted by Rusty:
I'm considering the TurboKool

Looks like a more expensive version of the Pla Kool I had years ago. Worked fine as long as the humidity was low. We got bit in the August AZ monsoons, when it was both hot and humid. Seems like a lot of money for a powered vent fan, a pad and a pump. I would be tempted to make my own, I think. I know you live in Florida and visit Nebraska. Western NE can be quite dry, but eastern NE is quite humid in summer, spring, winter and fall. Otherwise, OK, though.

quote:

bill h, how effective is the Swampy, and how do you hook it up (run the exhaust through a window or something?)

Like all swamp coolers, it is quite effective in dry weather. We only use it in the bedroom at night, so I don't know how it would do with any other use. It just recirculates the air, so no exhaust needed.

quote:

I've tried placing high density foam at different places around the Kohler to see if any noise can be suppressed, but according to my sound meter, the engine is so intrinsically noisy, the sound comes from everywhere.

It is easy to think than a material might be good and have it not be. Like Edison, all my experiments were not successes. I had a Southwind with the genset on the passenger side, so I got to hear it in its full glory. This impelled me to do the noise reduction thing. The first thing I did was eliminate the grille in the door, and convert it to bottom air in and out. I then lined the compartment with sound absorbing material, rather than sound blocking material such as one would use for a doghouse on a gasser. For gensets, I have had the best luck with Owens Corning 703. Since a genset has to get air in and out, blocking the sound is well nigh unto impossible, but the more sound absorbed, the less will get out. One inch 703 has a sound absorption coefficient close to 1.0 at higher frequencies. It didn't cut the noise inside much, but outside noise was greatly reduced. I'm with you on the Honda, but it will need some insulation to match the Microquiet.

Oh yeah....some of the Kohler noise comes from sheet metal parts hitting each other. A gob of Shoe Goo here and there helps. The fins ring, too, and I had good results with small rubber blocks between the fins, but I can't make them stay in position.

I have recently rerouted my exhaust to exit rearward rather than sideways right under the bedroom window and aimed at my neighbors awning area. At the same time, I welded in a small motorcycle glass pack muffler, the kind that is intended to stick into a straight pipe to pass a "fix it" ticket inspection. It only cut 1 DBA on the meter, but it changed the quality of the sound for the better, an improvement that the meter did not give full value. This is common, BTW. Honda, in particular shows readings that are higher than ears would indicate. Lots of this stuff is subjective, given the vagaries of the human ear and what passes for a brain.

Anyway, in Dry Branch parlance, I told you that so I could tell you this: Now, with the rearward exhaust, my 20 ft SPL readings are higher from the side than from the rear. That is with the door grille open. If I block the grille with a piece of Celotex Soundstop, the sound is reduced by quite a bit, subjectively. No measurements, as my meter was loaned out that day. I allow enough clearance around the Soundstop board for air flow. I know the Soundstop might not be ideal for this application, but I am having trouble finding OC703, and Lowe's has the Soundstop. It has an STC of 45. This, of course, tells me what we both already know, that the Kohler makes more mechanical noise than exhaust noise, and that a water-cooled genset would be easier to quiet.

Great suggestions as always...I used the foam to try to isolate where the most noise was coming from, before I tried suppressing it. A lot, unfortunately, is reflected off the ground from the bottom of the genset.

Most of the noise I'm getting seems to come from combustion (I don't hear any oilcanning or sheetmetal slapping, but it could be overpowered by the other noise). The fins could indeed be singing.

I've pretty much decided that trying to tame the Kohler is shoveling sand against the tide, so it's going to get replaced with something quieter and more efficient. Since the EV-4010/6010 are liquid-cooled, that suppresses a lot of noise right there, and it's possible that moving the radiator would allow a soundbox of some kind.

Last year in Nebraska (30 miles SW of Valentine), temp one day was 106F, with heat index of 102F - pretty dry - relative humidity, IIRC, was about 18%. Anyway, if I can get genset run times up to around 45-50 hours, an evaporative cooler would be unnecessary.